White Zombie
by Daina Darzin "She died instantly and was almost decapitated," intones a radio announcer, sampled from a 1967 news broadcast reporting Jayne Mansfield's death. Pyro explodes! Kids scream! A giant red "WHITE ZOMBIE" sign flashes madly. Flickering images of Charles Manson and the band's seminal inspiration, Bela Lugosi (White Zombie is named after one of his movies), float above the stage on huge screens.Out front, fearless leader Rob Zombie, guitarist J. Yuenger, and bassist Sean Yseult -- feminist inspiration and/or rock-goddess fantasy of metalheads everywhere -- form a whirling dervish of flying dreadlocks and stomping riffs, propelled by their current drummer, John Tempesta (formerly of Testament). It's a show that says, "Fuck all this low-key, anti-ambitious, flannel-shirt crap. We know how to be an arena band."
Backstage at the Nassau Coliseum in suburban Long Island, New York, a big-time Enormodome vibe prevails, from the complex levels of passes and laminates, to the army of crew guys and assistants, to the lovely dinner buffet. Its art/noise roots notwithstanding, White Zombie has become Kiss for the dysfunctional, mutant '90s, with a Top 10 soon-to-be double-platinum album, Astro Creep: 2000 - Songs of Love, Destruction and Other Synthetic Delusions of the Electric Head.
Like his fire-breathing predecessor Gene Simmons, Rob Zombie has a keen business sense, exerting substantial control over every phase of White Zombiedom, from artwork to financial planning. As a former publicist for the group once put it: "They're the perfect band. They look like monsters, but they show up on time for all their interviews."
Have you finally fulfilled all your special-effects dreams?
There's always more! The problem with that is, once you start, you think of 10 more things. But there was enough money to keep it going, and I'm just going to add on as we go along.
What's your favorite effect?
We had this guy build these crucified clowns that come down from the lighting rig. They're really cool. The show's pretty expensive. There's so many hidden costs you forget about, like we want to add more pyro. That means more crew, which means we need another bus 'cause we can't fit any more people on this one. Which means another truck. And another truck driver. And next thing you know, this one little thing ends up costing an extra $10,000 a week. It's like every time a piece of pyro goes off it's lit another hundred-dollar bill on fire.
You've always loved pyro.
It's fun. Everybody, after the shows, comments on it: "This is the most fun I've had at a show for a long long time, and blah blah blah." A lot of bands have really been skimping on it.
Having fun seems unimportant to a lot of bands. Why do you think that is?
I think a weird thing happened in music where music press started becoming too important. People stopped just listening for what they liked and started reading for what they liked. The press is really into oversaturating with bands that no one is buying their record but they're always on the cover of the magazines, like, "We're going to force the American public to like these bands whether they do or not." I don't know why. There's so many times I see someone on a cover of a magazine, an act that sells 20,000 records, where the average person must be completely confused, like, "Who is this?"
Rock critics want to amplify their own tastes, whereas most people like loud music and round sound waves -- accessible stuff.
I think a lot of critics feel that if a lot of people like it, it's not worth liking. If it has a small audience, it's better. They like to have these elitist tastes because they like to feel they're above the general population. Which is a weird way to look at it. Music should be entertainment, not this snooty little phony... It's like the world of fine art has turned into this rich, elitist, stupid scam where idiots with no talent are making a fortune off other idiots with no taste who have lots of money.
Is that why you dropped out of art school?
Yeah, it was like a joke. I think that's going to change soon, though, because there's only so long that kids are going to go, "Look, we just don't like these bands. Stop trying to make us like them. Leave us alone."
You guys are certifiably huge now. Is that strange for you after all those years of being broke and struggling?
This week is actually the strangest, because the record went back up the charts. Not only is it selling way more than we imagined, it's getting bigger.
It's bigger than you thought? Weren't the people at Geffen really psyched for it?
They probably say that about everything. I thought, well, if it sells what the last one sells [1992's La Sexorcisto: Devil Music Vol. 1 went platinum after a grueling two years of the band touring], or half that, that'd be cool. But for it to outsell the last one in two months is amazing. Especially now, when heavy music is not the most commercial thing.
Well, Green Day did really well.
That's the new wave of it, which I don't really feel a part of.
What do your parents think about all this? Are they impressed?
They were at the show last night, and they were really thrilled with the whole thing. Before, I would have to explain it to make it sound exciting, but now they can come and there's thousands of people jumping around. They got more excited when it entered their world: "Yeah, the plumber's son is really into you guys!" Then it's real to them.
Do some of the kids who are into you give you pause?
There was this one in Detroit who was amazing: He had this huge White Zombie tattoo covering his whole back, and he was able to pop his eyeballs out of his sockets at will. He was double-jointed in his eyes or something. He popped his eyes completely out. It was awesome.
But no one's stalked you or anything?
Not yet.
It seems like it's very important to you to control everything about your career. Do you think the point will come where you'll delegate more, or do you like it this way?
I only do it because I have to. There's things I want to control, the fun stuff, but there's little stupid things that I'd really rather not waste my day on. The key is to slowly find people you can trust. Like this guy Norman, who built the set [from Rob's drawings]. I can tell him my idea and he can just do it, and it'll be exactly what I want. It's not like I have to hang over his shoulder and oversee every little thing. It's really hard to find people where you say it and they know what you mean.
Are people that stupid, or are you just very exacting?
A lot of people are stupid. A lot of people want to cut corners and do it some cheesy way. And I'm always asking for something that hasn't been done before, which isn't the easiest thing to fulfill. It's really hard to find people who are on the same wavelength.
When the band first signed with Geffen and you insisted on making marketing decisions, did the label take you seriously?
At first, it's always a battle. Because when you're unknown and unsuccessful, who the hell wants to listen to you? As things kept working more and more, they kept loosening up more and more to where now they just go with it. If it's not broken, they're not going to fix it.
What were they the most resistant to?
One of their biggest things is trying to control and direct the videos. [A band controlling its videos] is not exactly the norm. A lot of bands are like, "Yeah, we wanna do it," and then they don't, they totally slack off on it. You're living down other bands' reputations: "No, we're not going to do what so-and-so did."
I know you've codirected all your videos, but you actually directed "More Human Than Human." What is that experience like for you?
I'll do the new one, for "Electric Head Pt. 2 (The Ecstasy)," on the break. The hardest part is you're directing yourself, I can't see what I'm doing, so I'm trying to keep an eye on what's going on and perform at the same time. It would be easier if I could stand back and look at it.
Do you eventually want to direct films?
Oh, yeah, I'd much rather do something that doesn't involve a band lip-synching. I hate that about videos. It's limiting because you come up with all these ideas and then it's like, how do I incorporate a band into it? A video is basically like a TV commercial; it's an advertisement for the record. I want to start making some small films when I get a chance.
Your Airheads experience [White Zombie appeared in the movie, a critical and financial flop] didn't put you off regular movies?
Nah, it was kind of fun to see how wasteful and stupid they are with movies. It's what you always wonder about with movies: Why do they suck, and why do they cost so much? Once I got involved with it, it was kind of obvious: There's too many people, and no one wants to be responsible for a decision that could backfire. They just shovel money out the window as fast as possible. Even on the video we made for [Airheads], movie people would come watch it and no one could make up their mind. They had to be told whether or not they liked it.
Why do you think it is that way?
Because most of the people who hold those positions aren't really fans of music or films, they're just businesspeople making a product.
But, on the other hand, you have a really good business head. I understand you worked out your record-company financial arrangements in an unusual way.
A lot of times you they cross-collateralize everything so you're always in debt. We usually function fairly cheaply and recoup fast. I'm in the business thing only because you have to be, not 'cause it's big fun. Anyone who isn't usually ends up broke.
By the end of last tour, you were all pretty fried. Are you going to go that long this time?
Touring's weird because there never seems to be an end. The world is pretty big. Just when you finish the U.S. tour, somebody's like, "How about South America? How 'bout Japan? How 'bout Europe?" There's a lot of ground to cover.
Where do you want to go most?
Nowhere. I don't care. The thing is, I don't like to travel. To tour endlessly is kind of weird for me.
So going to, say, Australia is not a big thrill.
Maybe if I knew I was going to go lay on the beach or chase kangaroos. But I know I'm going to sit backstage in some crappy club eating bad food.
Did you personally pick your opening bands?
Yeah. I wanted to do something different because it seems like every time we tour, we get a list of bands that are available, and it's always the same bands. And I'll be like, these guys just did the Megadeth tour, the Pantera tour, the Danzig tour, everyone has seen them. So I got bands the kids wouldn't expect to see, some variety. There's nothing worse than having four hours and four bands of the relatively same music. I like Reverend Horton Heat; I saw them at the Whisky, and I thought they were awesome. It's rockabilly, but it's high-energy enough to work. You can tell most of the kids haven't been exposed to it, but they're into it. Kyuss we met on the Danzig tour. Babes in Toyland, we used to always play with them way back, and it was cool to have a band from another scene.
Do you write at all on the road?
Nah. We might do a song on this John Lennon tribute record, but that's about it. There's a million things I'm trying to do, but on tour it's like you drive, you get there, you eat, you play, you're tired. I've tried to think of setting up things to draw backstage, but it's impossible. I have a million notebooks I write things down in, but projects are stacking up.
Like what?
Well, I wanted to do this short movie based on one of the songs. I'm doing this White Zombie comic book with Marvel Comics, which is dragging out forever. It's more of an anthology of stories, the world of White Zombie. The band's not really in it as superheroes on an adventure. That would be stupid. And now there's this CD-ROM thing, where you can play it as a regular CD, but played on the right system it goes through this whole thing. This just started today. Also, Glenn Danzig offered me some work to do in Verotik, a card set and some stories for one of his comics. Plus the videos, plus the fact that we're gearing up to do another U.S. leg of the tour in October, and I want to redo the whole stage. And somewhere in there I sleep.
What haven't you done yet?
I feel like I haven't hardly done anything. All these projects, movie things, comic things, I feel like I'm just getting my foot in the door.
What happened to you guys playing on Lollapalooza?
We backed out of it 'cause it sounded kind of lame. [Originally, the headliners were to be] the Clash -- they were gonna re-form -- and Snoop Doggy Dogg. We thought that sounded cool. Two months later, it's a totally different bill. Also, we didn't want to play in the sun. We wanted to do our show. Playing in the sunlight seemed like ripping off our fans, giving them a half-assed show.
Speaking of Snoop Doggy Dogg, there's a new wave of politicians attacking Hollywood and the music industry. Have you gotten any backlash from that?
Not really. It seems like every few years it's the same thing. Time to get reelected, let's pick out really obvious records to point at. It doesn't affect us because now they have rap music to be scared of. W.A.S.P. isn't cool, se we'll hold up a 2Pac record. I guess it's a serious thing, but it's hard to take seriously because it's so laughable. [On the other hand], the rappers may not want to be role models, but what they're saying is completely influencing kids. You can't deny it. I know that from being onstage, and it's very easy to say something, and those kids will do it.
Do you feel the responsibility of being a role model?
Not like a role model, but you have to realize there's a certain amount of influence in what you say. If you don't want to stand up for the consequences of what you say, then don't fuckin' say it. Don't say it, and then when something happens, go cry, "No, I'm not trying to tell people what to do." I have to be careful onstage about what I say. You're riding a real fine line between getting arrested for inciting a riot or whatever.
Have you had any incidents like that?
A couple of times the promoters and cops were backstage, ready to arrest me for things I said. Next time they had written statements: "You will immediately go to jail if you say this and that."
What did you say that provoked them?
Anything about getting kids to leave their seats and ignore the security -- doing anything involving fun, basically. It's weird; the American way is not taking responsibility for anything. Everybody wants their own complete freedom, but no one wants to take responsibility. That's why this country is falling apart: "I wanna run around and fuck everybody, but I don't wanna take care of the children." The whole country is based around that, a bunch of kids with no families. You see it when you watch those talk shows. You can laugh at it, but the bottom line is: Both of the kids parents are in prison, and that's why the kid is running around wild in the streets. It's real simple.
What do you think the answer is?
[One thing is] there's too fucking many people. I don't think anyone should have more than two kids, because the school systems can't handle it. We have the freedom to do it, but the reality is, it's stupid.
I read somewhere that you read Helter Skelter as a little kid, and that it had a big effect on you.
I think I was too young to read it. I was just looking at the pictures, going "Wow." People always ask me, "Why are you fascinated with this?" I don't know. I just can always remember things like that, and cool stuff was on TV, like The Addams Family and The Munsters and Star Trek. I didn't watch Barney. I remember having this Dark Shadows game where you had to assemble a skeleton. The skeleton glowed in the dark.
Do you eventually want little White Zombie running around?
Yeah, probably.
Would you do what Al Jourgensen does and have 'em come out on tour?
No, that doesn't seem like a healthy thing. Kids have to have a fairly stable home life. Whatever happened to you as a kid seems to stick with you. You try to outlive it, but it's usually whatever is right or wrong with your personality.
What stuck with you the most?
I was always kind of a loner and had these dreams of moving to some other place, and that's just the way I am. I don't have a lot of friends, but I have a lot of drive to do things.
How long do you see yourself in this phase of your life?
I always think, for this kind of music, there's an age where it becomes embarrassing. There should be a mandatory retirement age.
And what should that be?
I don't know. But everybody should be able to figure it out for themselves, so that no one's standing behind you, pointing at you and laughing. When you're playing in front of kids who are the same age as your kids, it's time to stop and go home.